In this week's episode, guest expert Janni Aragon joins us to talk about finding your academic style, changing styles as you move back and forth between administration and teaching, having fun with your style, some of the challenges of being a woman of color in the academy, and supporting other women. We wrap up with tips on having an academic style while letting your personality shine through and we end with an assignment for our listeners - share a selfie of your style with #AcademicStyle and tag us @university_of_venus on IG and @UVenus on Twitter or post it on our Facebook page at http://www.facebook.com/UVenus/ and we will share, retweet, and amplify! Find University of Venus on Instagram @university_of_venus , Twitter @UVenus , and Facebook http://www.facebook.com/UVenus/
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Music Credits: Magic by Six Umbrellas
View from Venus Episode 1
Mary Churchill: Hello everyone, and welcome to this week’s episode of the View from Venus. Today’s co-hosts are Mary Churchill, Meg Palladino, and Lee Skallerup Bessette and today’s guest expert is Janni Aragon.
We are going to be talking about everyone's love/hate topic - work style or in our world - academic style - what do you wear to work and how do you keep it true to who you are?
You will walk away with our best tips and advice for nailing your academic style and at the end, we’ll have an assignment for you.
Without further ado. Let me tell you a little about Janni
Janni is a self-described, “feminist Political Scientist, educator, another wise Latina & mentor.” She works in the Department of Political Science at the University of Victoria (UVIC) in Victoria on Vancouver Island in British Columbia, Canada. We asked her here today because we love her style. Earlier this summer, over at the UVenus blog, we asked folks to comment on their academic style and this was Janni’s response:
“I like to dress up Monday through Wednesday and dress a little more casually on Thursday and Friday. I am fond of dresses and typically wear those at the start of the week, then pants and jeans at the end of the week with a blouse or appropriate t-shirt and swacket (sweater/jacket) or blazer. I tend to live in my birkenstocks and other sandals in the Spring and Summer and then move to flats and boots for the Fall and Winter, given the rain.
I also appreciate political pins on my clothes and jewelry. I have no issues wearing big hoops and bright lipstick, too. I often think that I am honoring my inner Latina I wear my bright colors and hoops. Because of the vagaries of higher ed, sexism, and racism, I have learned that I have to dress up more. I am a short woman and a woman of color, so I am keenly aware of how I am perceived by some. Thus, being more dressed up is perhaps my armour for academia.”
I love that! Ok, Meg is going to get us started with a fun question for all
Meg Palladino: Okay, so this episode's fun question is if you could describe your style by comparing it to a character in a movie or on TV, what would it be?
Mary Churchill: And this is a question for all of us. So anyone can jump in
Meg Palladino: I mean mine is probably Wednesday Addams in pajamas.
Mary Churchill: That's awesome. Lee?
Lee Skallerup Bessette: That's a really good question because I don't think, I've never, I've struggled to like see myself on there. So I guess it's, it would be any of the quirky best friends that would be like in the rom-com the quirky best friend like that would be basically my style.
Right? So it's not supposed to be noticeable as to outshine the star of the rom-com. I'm the… I'm the quirky sidekick.
Mary Churchill: I like that. When I saw this really briefly this question, I thought oh, I've always wanted to be like That Girl or Mary Tyler Moore or something but you know, but with like I guess with paisley and Docs- Doc Martens. So I don't know maybe Tank Girl, Tank Girl is one I would love to be but not at work, right?
Lee Skallerup Bessette: Drew Barrymore in the 90s like that?
Mary Churchill: Yeah. Yeah.
Lee Skallerup Bessette: 90s Drew Barrymore, 90s Alicia Silverstone,
Mary Churchill: Janni?
Janni Aragon: I'm thinking about an array of different characters in Shondaland. You know, I mean I have these green, long gloves that I wear when it gets cool here. So it's usually during the winter and I feel like Kerry Washington and Scandal in them.
Mary Churchill: I love that
Janni Aragon: So, you know, there's some days that I'm...And it probably be Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday where I'm more stylish and then Thursday, Friday, I'm kind of like... well, Monday through Wednesday stylish chic, if you will and then Thursday, Friday more [00:02:00] sporty stylish, you know I have on a blazer, a tank top with skulls on it, dark jeans, and some waterproof sneaks that are, that go above the ankle.
So and you know a bracelet and a political necklace that says "Feminist Killjoy."
Mary Churchill: I love that
Lee Skallerup Bessette: and I'm glad you mentioned Scandal because I do have my Kerry Washington winter coat. It's not white but it is a very light beige. Whenever I put that on. I'm like, yeah, this feels like my Scandal coat.
This is like... they drink so much red wine and nothing ever gets stained. I'm so so jealous of that but my one my one splurge was that that winter coat at one point. I was like, yeah, this is my Kerry Washington Scandal coat.
Mary Churchill: Excellent. So we have some questions for you. And I think we're going to start off with Lee.
Lee Skallerup Bessette: So you got into this just in answering that question a little bit, but Janni, how would you describe your current style in a little bit more detail?
Janni Aragon: I think my current style is definitely professional. Polished and stylish and then I always have some sort of flare be it my jewelry or a necklace, political button that sort of thing and I love shoes.
I have more than I should have. So yeah, I think I'm kind of stylish and funky
Lee Skallerup Bessette: so to follow up some quick follow-up how many of those shoes are Fluevogs?
Janni Aragon: only two
Lee Skallerup Bessette: okay,
Janni Aragon: not that many. There's a local store called The Cobbler and I have probably about 10 samples from them. And so the sample is you know, it's a size 7 because I'm a size 7 and no one else in the city will have that shoe unless they bought it at another store in another part of the province or a different Province because they only had one of them that's our goal.
That's why it's a sample.
Lee Skallerup Bessette: Oh, wow, that's awesome. I’m going to have to remember that next time. I visit my mother-in-law in Victoria.
Janni Aragon: Yeah. I'm lucky in that respect because samples are usually a size 7 and so I'm on the list so they call me when there are sales and. Yeah, I probably have it's probably closer to a dozen shoes from The Cobbler that are samples and so I've never seen anyone else with the same shoe on be if it's a Portuguese, platform or you know, whatever the heck it is.
So I love shoes. They can really dress up a pair of jeans, t-shirt, and a blazer.
Lee Skallerup Bessette: Yeah, I like I like it out in a pop of color unexpected color on my feet because I think that that's can sometimes be really a really fun thing to do with something, you know plain, more plain. So, how did you how did you get here?
How did you get to this style? What was your sort of evolution to get to this point in your style journey?
Janni Aragon: Well, I realized that I needed to always look professional so that students wouldn't think - initially when I started teaching 22 years ago – so they wouldn't think that I was one of them. And frankly I can remember once it would have been probably 1997 or 1998 fall, I came to class in a nice blouse but a pair of jeans and I heard under a student's breath to another student, “Oh my God, I can't believe she's wearing jeans. How unprofessional.” and I had a rough group that term just in terms of being disrespectful and so I didn't wear jeans for several years after that I'd say probably.
Never again at state but I want to say it was five years later and it was a pair of dark jeans that just look a little bit more dressy. Yet, I would see you know, some of my male colleagues in jeans and a t-shirt and sneakers. I could never dress like that. I needed to come in with you know, being a short Latina woman I need to come in looking professional like I belonged at the front of the classroom.
So I think that my evolution of my style has always been stylish and professional with, you know lots of reds. I love reds. I love bright colors. I can get away with it with my olive skin, dark hair, but I would, you know have a pair of nice heels on as well and you know some sort of jewelry, too.
Lee Skallerup Bessette: Great. I really relate to that too. When I started my PhD I was really young and no one believed that I was the instructor of record. And so it took it took a long time actually for people to be like, oh my gosh, you're the you're the instructor and one of the challenges with that to I find that that it's kind of unspoken about is that I couldn't afford to upgrade my wardrobe at that point.
So I was just sort of stuck with what I had in terms of that because it was like I really couldn't afford and I was moving to a new city. So I didn't know any of the resources to find, you know, cheap second-hand clothes that were nice and so it's a challenge. I think particularly for women grad students who are aspiring to a more professional look but you know, might not have access to it.
Janni Aragon: Right. I'm a big thrift store shopper and consignment store shopper and almost anything I'd buy if it's brand new it's on sale. You know, that's just born in my blood is so I you know, I just bought a short pair of purple and black Roma boots.
Lee Skallerup Bessette: Yeah all of my time in rural Eastern Kentucky. I learned how to find deals on the internet and I learned how to internet shop that the outlet the outlet sites all of that kind of stuff for that that same reason I'm in the same way of not wanting to pay full price. So. I'm right there with you on that.
Janni Aragon: I was thinking about this podcast a few days ago. And when I first immigrated to the Pacific Northwest coming, I’m American living in Canada, although I did become a Canadian citizen a little over a year ago, but I remember talking to my girlfriend after I'd been here for about six months saying, “Wow, the women here are really rugged.” She laughed and she's Latina as well and she said: “Oh, yeah that totally reminds me when I was in Colorado for a decade, you know, I felt like I wore a lot of makeup.” And I said, “me too.” I just wear lipstick, eyeliner, and eyeshadow but most of the women here don't wear makeup.
And so I found, especially when I first started teaching here, a lot of colleagues and students would comment on my clothes, my hair, you know the way I looked. Did I have a job interview? And then I started to notice that other women of color also dress it up, you know, they might not wear makeup, but it was just understood,
Lee Skallerup Bessette: And you see if you went to Montreal it would be completely different where people do still dress up in Montreal and then we're a lot more makeup. There's that sort of French influence in Montreal. And so it does vary regionally very much so in Canada in that kind of way.
Mary Churchill: So, you've kind of addressed this but I'm going to ask it anyway and kind of the for me, you know, it's interesting that you talked about wearing jeans and having a backlash. I remember when I think it was probably the first time I taught in jeans was.. after… the first time I taught after I had my baby, right?
So I was a wreck, physically and jeans were really the only thing that were comfortable enough to teach in and so I was wearing jeans, but I think there was something about being in the space of someone who had just had a baby that just gave me more gravitas, right? Like it instantly kind of pushed me into this older person like, oh, you're old you have a kid, right, but I agree like it's really tough.
And I also think like higher ed can be really stuffy and I think this is true, especially on the administrative side. And so I think it can be really challenging when you're first starting out teaching or if you're an administrator to still have fun with your style. And so there it's almost like I think of it as like code-switching right where you're like, okay, what do what's appropriate in this meeting or this setting and how do you have fun even when it's a really stuffy situation because you're I think your style is really fun and funky and so, how do you keep that alive?
Janni Aragon: Well, I wore a lot of dresses when I was an academic administrator. And you know, one of my favorite lipstick colors is from MAC and it's Verve and I definitely wore a lot of verve whereas now going back to full-time teaching.
I'm wearing more of my viva glamour - Viva Glam, excuse me, MAC lipsticks. Definitely more bright than I was before. But I found that I just tried to be me as an academic administrator, but not the, not as bold of lipstick and I might have toned down some of the political buttons and necklaces. I don't wear them quite as much maybe on teaching days.
But but I do find that, you know, people will often respond politely. That I you know always look well put together or something to that effect. Yeah.
Mary Churchill: Very cool.
Meg Palladino: So when you dress up for like a work event or something, what does that look like?
Janni Aragon: It could be a nice blouse, a blazer, a pair of slacks or a dress.
You know, I love dresses or clothes - fabric with cherries. And so, you know last month when Imogen Coe, you know really big name in STEM in Canada was on campus that day. I wore my black dress with cherries on it. And she had her Fluevogs on, a nice pair of slacks, and a blazer. But her Fluevogs were beautiful. I mean, they were the pop in her outfit and over lunch after her talk, she made a comment about my dress and my attitude and it was kind of like yeah one badass woman giving the hat tip to another and I just felt… I probably blushed
Lee Skallerup Bessette: and I think and I know I brought up the Fluevogs and it’s kind of an inside joke for Canadian academics for women academics even men too because I make men shoes that like you've made it when you purchase your first pair of Fluevogs.
Right, like that's how you've made it as a woman academic in Canada. I've got my Fluevog boots on right now like pulled them out because it's autumn and I can pull out my Fluevog boots and I'm like super happy about that. So it's just this really it's available here in the States, but it started up. He's a Canadian shoemaker and so that it's the Fluevog the Fluevog. You go to Congress and I mean all the women at least one of the days are probably wearing Fluevogs.
It's. It's pretty funny.
Mary Churchill: Yeah, I bought my first pair of this this year for the first time. They're so expensive.
Meg Palladino: You know, I used to wear them all the time when I was younger and now I'm like, maybe I need a pair
Mary Churchill: you do
Meg Palladino: I used to have this awesome red cowboy boots Fluevogs, I loved.
Mary Churchill: Awesome. Nice. Well, I have
Lee Skallerup Bessette: fantastic
Mary Churchill: first Docs and yeah, my first Fluevogs I'm just loving them.
Okay, so this is kind of we're to the wrap-up part of this. So this is kind of really what are people's major takeaways and top tips for “How do you keep an academic style that lets your personality shine through?” So who wants to start?
Janni Aragon: I'll start. I think you just need to be you. You know, I if you is political tee shirts and slacks and your favorite black blazer almost every day or a swacket, you know, if it works for you then that's fine.
The thing that I also want to say with that is just supporting other women, you know, we have to support one another.
Lee Skallerup Bessette: I would say and this is this is coming from a unique perspective, but I think it's also don't be afraid to change your style. That you know you grow and evolve and mature and life changes and your position changes and all of that kind of stuff that it's okay to change it up.
Right? It's okay to sort of lets, you know, let pieces of your style go because they don't quote unquote fit maybe literally, maybe literally but also figuratively. That you know some of the, as our bodies change as we get go through that, you know. That was something was really hard for me was certain things that were part of my style that worked before I had kids or even you know at my lowest weight, didn't necessarily work anymore. And so I had to just sort of let that go and find and embrace and find what did work now, you know, so I think being open to that and you know, it's be yourself but also realize that yourself changes and evolves and it's okay for your style to change and evolve too.
Meg Palladino: For me, I feel like comfort is so important. I'm not into athleisure although I do have a colleague that shows up every day in athleisure. But yeah if I'm comfortable, I feel like I'm happy. So it's always kind of finding that balance between comfort and professional.
Lee Skallerup Bessette: Sweatshirt dresses
Meg Palladino: I would like one of those
Lee Skallerup Bessette: Kind of sweatshirt dress.
Mary Churchill: So, I’m always trying to find the sneaker that looks like a dress shoe or the dress shoe that looks like a sneaker kind of thing.
Lee Skallerup Bessette: Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's when I discovered the sweatshirt dress, I was like, this changes everything.
Meg Palladino: I need one.
Mary Churchill: I am definitely, Mine has evolved over time because I think when I was younger, especially in administration, I it was more like it was a uniform.
I felt like very little of my personality came through like maybe a scarf maybe earrings. But as I've gotten older I think there's just a certain thing about being older too especially when you're teaching like that, you know, you mentioned that early on of when you're closer to the student age, it's more challenging but now it's necklaces and like the way I do my hair and you know tights or shoes and really keeping a little bit of flare in there. Even if I have to wear a black suit for a really formal event, trying to have a funky scarf and some really cool earrings and having that be consistent and kind of. You know and I love it when people say oh man, I really love that necklace. Right? So kind of then noticing is back to what you said you said Janni, it's like being there for other women seeing other women commenting on it and supporting one another for having a little funkiness and not feeling like you have to blend into the background, right? So
Janni Aragon: absolutely absolutely I mean in my experience the comments about how much I dress up from other women who are usually white women, I would explain but you don't understand I need to come in and own the room, you know be there feeling more powerful because some of these students aren't used to seeing someone like me and I'm a first generation college student.
You know, now I have all this education, privilege, class privilege that sort of thing but. Being the first of my family, you know, I was traveling new ground in so many different ways.
Mary Churchill: Yeah, definitely.
Janni, thanks so much. That was awesome. Thanks to all of you. That was a fantastic conversation.
We like to end each episode with homework or an assignment for our listeners. This week we want you to take a selfie showing your academic style or if you’re not into selfies, take a photo of your favorite academic style. Maybe it’s the style you aspire to have like my Tank Girl crossed with Mary Tyler Moore/That Girl
Name it after a tv or movie character and post it on Instagram or Twitter and tag @UVenus with the hashtag #AcademicStyle. We’ll retweet it, share it in our IG story, and post it on our Facebook page. Thanks so much for spending time with us.
And here’s a preview of next week. We’ll be back next Thursday on Halloween, with special guest Erica Feldmann of HausWitch and we’ll be talking witches, radical feminism, rethinking your office space, and creating mental clarity.
As always, thank you for listening.